Speaker 0 00:00:00 Your next gig is right around the corner. I'm excited for how we are going to be able to continue going forward each and every day to get better and better for the next gig. And the one after that at gig ready, our goal is to help you be better than you are today, to be more prepared and a better asset to your customers and your clients each and every day, going forward value for value is how we operate. That means if you get value out of what we're doing, we would love. If you would return some of that value to us, tell your friends, leave a review on iTunes or another podcast app. Let us know what you think. If you want to hear something new, something different, share it with us gig
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Speaker 1 00:01:01 <inaudible>
Speaker 0 00:01:16 Welcome everyone to gig ready today. We have an outstanding guest with us to talk all things COVID safety, post COVID and what it's going to look like to help each and every one of us be able to get back to work in the future. Jim Digby, co-founder president of the event. Safety Alliance is here to be with us, talking more about everything around, getting back to work. Jim, thanks for being here. So glad to have you. Thanks for taking
Speaker 2 00:01:44 Jordan. Good to see you again. It's been a long time. Now we get some time together on the road. Didn't we?
Speaker 0 00:01:50 We did just a couple of years running around the world, had a lot of fun, good times. Um, I, some of the best memories that I have, especially from touring was with you guys and Lincoln park and Backstreet boys. And it was a lot of fun. So
Speaker 2 00:02:08 That was it. That was a fun period in, uh, in our professional journey. Huh?
Speaker 0 00:02:14 It was, um, kind of going back to that, actually I tell a lot of people about the time I went in to tell you that I was going to be moving on from Lincoln park and like how scared out of my pants I was to tell you, cause I was like, Oh my gosh, he's going to be so pissed off that. I'm like, think I'm leaving and think I'm jumping ship. Um, and, and surprise, like to my absolute shock, I, I I've actually, haven't even told you this before to my absolute shock. You looked right at me. And you said, that's incredible, super excited for you. I'm really happy. You're welcome back anytime. And I mean, yeah,
Speaker 2 00:02:54 We were, there were gracious guys and, and you know, the lessons of leadership over the years, um, have taught me to build people up as much as you can, and then watch them fly the nest and take the journey for themselves. Right? Mean it's all of our individual journeys. And I think our role as leaders is to, um, is to enable everyone else to have the incredible journey of their own, not my standards by any means. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:03:22 That's I can tell you honestly, it was one of the best things that ever happened to me. And I can honestly say and genuinely say, thank you because I did not expect it.
Speaker 2 00:03:31 I'm so happy for your success. Truly welcome.
Speaker 0 00:03:34 Thank you. Um, uh, you know, I'm excited to talk about going forward. Everybody's most people, especially touring people have been out of work for six going on seven months. Now stuff's still canceling into 2021. Um, I know the events safety Alliance has been working really hard to come up with criteria and give people a glimpse as to what the future is gonna look like in terms of touring, what do we do going forward? Um, but before we get into that, let's talk a little bit about the ESA, the event safety Alliance. Give me a quick 32nd synopsis of what is the ESA, what is the intention and what do you, what do we see the ESE ESA being able to do going forward?
Speaker 2 00:04:18 Well, that's not going to fit in 30 seconds. Yeah, that's all good that the ESA was born out of, um, the Indiana state fair stage collapse, which, you know, in the immediate aftermath, um, folks were blaming the weather and blaming it properly built stage. Um, and you know, anyone with a conscious in a leadership role should have been asking themselves after that happened. Geez, could that have been me? Um, that's that was certainly my reaction was like, Oh my God, what happened? How did it happen? Could that be me? What don't I know that could have allowed that to have happened to me. God, I had just started having a family. I did not ever, I never wanted to find myself in, in, in the godawful place. Everybody involved with that event were and, um, and went on a journey of professional development. How can I learn to not let that happen?
Speaker 2 00:05:17 Uh, and at the same time, uh, we started kind of a round Robin, a slew of phone calls with great minds across the industry and staging and you know, and vendor side and production side. Um, and that conversation was two people that it was four people and it was eight people. The next thing you know, it was 20 odd people. And then within a year or so, the event safety Alliance was born as a nonprofit advocacy group, uh, with the hope that we would prevent an Indiana like event from happening again. Um, you know, the good news as we dug into Indiana was if there was good news to have about it, when, uh, when we're teaching that moment, we asked the class what caused people to die in Indiana. And quite often the answer is, well, the weather or, well, the stage. And while those are complicit, for sure, we argue that that's not the cause what caused people to die in Indiana?
Speaker 2 00:06:18 We argue that what caused people to die in Indiana was lack of a coordinated, actionable plan. That was well community communicated across the teams. And the good news about that, why there is a light because of that statement is that that's something we can fix. We can't change the weather. There will be structural failures, but we can implement planning, uh, across all of the multi agencies involved with events, um, that can help us be better prepared to avoid a repetition of Indiana. For sure. And the challenge came as, as you know, that was 2011, when that happened 2012, the formation of the ESA. And then there was Christina Grimmie and the pulse nightclub in Las Vegas and the bottom line and Manchester and all of these other subsequent events that we weren't necessarily focused on as an organization. We hadn't had to be reasonably prepared for those things. They'd never happened to our industry before. So with each of those failures came a new learning opportunity for both the ESA and then subsequently the folks that were listening to the things that we talk about. Yeah, that's the shortest synopsis as I can give you Jordan.
Speaker 0 00:07:30 No, that's great. I edit includes a lot of things that I hadn't even considered when it comes to looking at the ESA and all of the things that, that it can be, uh, that it can be. I remember you telling me back in the mid 20, 2013, 2014, about how you basically said, do we want to be able to dictate our own future from a safety standpoint or do we want someone else to dictate it for us? Um, you know, and
Speaker 2 00:07:55 Yeah, that was, that was born out of, uh, Indiana governor Daniels at the time Mitch Daniels had, um, you know, his task force had come back with some rather odious, um, onerous, uh, uh, responses to what had happened in Indiana. I think I heard they were going to move the state fair indoors. They were going to relocate the nearest audience member to the stage was going to be outside the following radius of the stage. So these things were not going to bode well for live events. And in fact, you know, they would be detrimental to us as an industry if that became the new operating, um, standard. So with some help from a fellow, from, uh, England who brought over the purple guy than existing rep, uh, uh, set of standards that speaks to live events. Um, and we got an appointment with Mr. Mitch Daniels and we were able to go there with a task force into the governor's office and meet with the governor and his, his working group. And we basically said, look, let us try to fix us. We know best on how, you know, we, the industry knows best on how to approach these sort of catastrophic failure. And we pledged to you that we're going to do everything we can and come back to you with some results. And to our surprise, he said, okay. And we then set off creating what is now the ESA ESA event, safety guide. So I'm 330 pages about safety and live events. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:09:25 And it's outstanding. And it covers everything from crowd control to people and onstage offstage structures. I mean, all of that. Um, and now you have the opportunity to add virus and outbreak to it. As
Speaker 2 00:09:40 That's when we thought we got a hold of it and we were getting in front right along, comes a global pandemic, uh, to really take us off our feet. And, you know, our, our, our response to the pandemic, really the vice-president Steve and Amanda and Jacob work, our operations director, um, their response was immediately to form a task group and, and begin crafting what it would look like. Should you get the opportunity to go back to work? Our fear at that time in late March, early April, was that our industry in a rush to get people back to work, we would do so without a reasonable safety measures. And because there weren't in, and we felt like if you know who better suited than the ESA to create these reasonable safety measures. So Don and Don, Steve and Jacob set off to do so with a group of about 3,300 smart friends about, um, and by may mid may, we were able to release the reopening guidance, which by and large today is still the most referenced, uh, material out there it's been downloaded officially through our channels.
Speaker 2 00:10:51 27,000 times. It addresses again the broad region of everything that we could possibly touch. As we know it now, that's not to say that we speak to every sector. Like we, we can't possibly speak to every show type because there are so many, but it is broad enough and scalable enough that any, any competent show producer and team would be able to use that as a reference guide in itself uses the who, and the CDC has reference material and construct their own safety practices for within whatever the thing is that they're doing. Um, and you know, one of the opening sentences, if it just because you can doesn't mean you should, right. So if you're gonna, if you're gonna do an event because the opportunity presents itself, please, please, please do it in a manner that doesn't cause further harm to the industry. As a whole, remember, there are 12 million of us out there out of work at the moment, right? Yeah. Um, so that was the premise we're, we're, I'm happy to tell you, uh, at the sick we're nearing the six month Mark, when we get there, hopefully we're going to be pushing a slightly modified version out, which takes into account the things we know now that we didn't know then about that. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:12:08 Okay. Awesome. And that's outstanding. Um, the, the guide, having looked through it and seen it, I mean, tons and tons and tons of information, almost information overload. It's almost too much to diag digest it at one time. Um, but those plans can really be, I mean, I do a lot of corporate events, hotels, things like that. And it's all applicable from the venue standpoint, from the people standpoint, ways to create and use it to, like you said, formulate a plan. Um, and I think people are going to have to spend time creating their own plans. They can't just grab something off the shelf. It just doesn't work that way. And they can't assume that, Oh, well the hotel or, Oh, the venue or, Oh, this they're going to have a plan. I mean, production managers are going to have to have a plan state managers, as part of that team are gonna have to have a plan. Um, and it's going to take time, but once we establish it, hopefully I think we would see a faster, um, uh, I guess a faster build out to that. So we can get back to work.
Speaker 2 00:13:15 Yeah. That th that you couldn't have, uh, have captured the most important point more eloquently. And that is, you know, plans. Aren't the things that save you. It's the planning process that saves you, right? That's when you're, you dedicate your brain to risk, uh, risk awareness, risk management, risk assessing, you know, um, uh, risk response. The process of planning causes you to think through the things that could go wrong and therefore it must be done in every event related to every event. Can you have a framework for putting a plan together? Yes, absolutely. Can you borrow Johnny's plan and bring it into work for you? No, you may not because your event, your audience, your venue, your artists, your structure, all of those things are going to be different. And each of those things require a different response when it comes to risk measurement. So that's to say, if I'm putting on a symphony and I have an audience of elderly people, that's a different exit strategy than if I'm putting on a heavy metal concert or I'm putting on, you know, a Phish concert. So we're, I'm putting on a conference in a hotel room or hotel structure. So you're absolutely right. Planning is unique to each and every event and each and every time, Jordan,
Speaker 0 00:14:42 What I'm kind of following up with that, what should people be doing right now to prepare for events to return eventually? I mean, you know, being aware of guidelines and things like that, but what are, what are some other things they should be doing to prepare for the eventual return of concerts and such?
Speaker 2 00:15:01 Yeah. Well, I, probably whatever we say today is going to be different tomorrow, but let's try to start. So, you know what we know about, uh, the, the basic tenants of the events, safety Alliance, reopening guidance of mask, wearing social distancing hand-washing and be kind to each other, those basic tenants are going to be true, no matter what. And when the early days of the events safety Alliance, when we talked about things falling down on people's heads and hardhats, we talked about kind of smartly gravity is the same everywhere, right? Yeah. And if gravity is the same here, as it is in Indonesia, then the rules that apply to gravity here are the same rules that apply to gravity. So that, that resonates true. I think, with the pandemic, right, this pandemic, doesn't, it doesn't deliver differently here from Hong Kong. One needs only to look to Japan and to Asia to see that mass squaring by and large prohibits this pet, this disease from spreading hand-washing, by-in-large prohibits this disease from spreading use Zealand, you know, full control over this thing because they committed to a plan and, and they followed the science go figure.
Speaker 2 00:16:20 Um, and, and now they're in a place where they're doing events. Didn't don't you wish we were there. So what does one do now? Well, one makes themselves familiar with the science around COVID one makes themselves aware of the, of the governmental regulations on the place where they intend to do an event and make sure that those two things kind of align. And as is the case when following safety standards or standards of any kind, you always follow the higher standard, not the least standard. Right. So if you, if that is, that is to say if the government standard is less, um, less prohibitive, I'm sorry. If the government standard is, is less, what's the word I'm looking for? Restrictive. Yeah. What'd you say? Constructive. Restricted. Yeah. So we want to follow the higher, higher standard. That was, I don't know why I got lost there, but anyway, that's all right. Um, so, uh, yeah, the first steps are, what is, you're going to put together? Who are the attendees going to be? What's this, what are, they're going to be attendees? Um, what are the local regulations? What's the building ventilation like, is it indoor? Is it outdoor? Um, can I get everybody to wear masks? Is there going to be alcohol, which will change the entire dynamic, the long laundry list?
Speaker 0 00:17:44 I hadn't even thought about the alcohol yet. Gosh, we're talking concerts, pulling snakes, you know, beer, state, beer spilled floors and everything else. Of course. There's I was watching the barricade good question. Um, we can spray Omni shield on it. It'll help keep the virus and the bacteria away so I can tell you that. Excellent. Um, what, what do you kind of expect events to look like from the standpoint of how are they going to look different? I mean, yes. Masks, social, you know, space in between people. I mean, we've been watching football for the last couple of weeks and you see, I mean, you know, it's like little spots, like fly specks around the, around the stadium. Um, man, I mean, what, what do we see as kind of the differences? I mean, one, one tour manager called me two weeks ago, said, Hey, we're going to be doing stuff in the round at whatever the capacity is allowed in that area, doing multiple shows in one location. Um, I mean, financially, it's going to be tough, but if we can get back to work, what do you see as some of the differences, um, going forward?
Speaker 2 00:18:49 Well, I, I think that the differences that relate to COVID are exactly what we just, what you just highlighted is what is the risk threshold for the artist? What's the risk threshold for the venue? What's the risk threshold for the local politicians? And I, you know, I personally am anyone who's attempting to, to produce a reasonably safe event, following reasonable guidelines. You know, I personally applaud that person because we've got to keep trying, that's the nature of who we are anyway, reinvent, reinvent, reinvent until we get the magic secret sauce. Um, you know, some of the problems with a, uh, uh, a capacity challenged event are obviously what's the metric look like what's the financial risk look like? And can we cause that event to at least break even, are we willing to take a loss just to have an event? Uh, you know, so, so in the risk calculation, all of those things have to be considered.
Speaker 2 00:19:51 Um, I think what I, what a teaser for me to say, what I, don't, what I would rather not see in that is people just throwing caution to the wind and saying, screw you, I know better there's the earth is flat and we're going to just do a show and everybody's going to be here. They're going to have 560,000 of our friends show up in Sturgis. And we're not wearing masks that, that scares the daylights out of me because that is potentially short-sided enough to continue to keep our industry down. And I know that, that, you know, I don't mean to sound smug, but I think it's, we carry the burden of having to do the best thing. We can restrict reasonable safety precautions in order to produce events in today's day. Once there's a vaccine, it's a whole new set of challenges. How do we know that everybody coming into the venue has had the vaccine?
Speaker 2 00:20:47 How do we know the vaccines, any good? How do we prohibit people who haven't, if that's going to be our thing, you know, if we're not going to do that, then what's the fault. I mean, the equation is very complex, which makes it interesting. It also means that there is no one right answer. And I think depending on how you're qualifying your answers, if I were qualified, Mansour's based on how will this stand up in a court of law, I'm going to do everything reasonable that I possibly can and potentially above reasonable to ensure that I don't cause harm or, or someone to catch this disease. Yeah. I think that's, you know, that's as broad a statement as you can make about it. We don't really know is the bottom line. Yeah,
Speaker 0 00:21:36 No, I get it. Um, well, I mean, looking forward to those LA you know, the, the, the new guidelines from the ESA as we've learned more, and we, I mean, yeah, I mean, may to now has even been such a huge progression and difference, um, you know, of knowledge and information that we've gained the, um, the events that are going to happen going forward. There's going to be new people involved. Who do you see as the new players within, uh, events? I mean, there's been a lot of talk of COVID compliance officers. Officer may not be the right word. It just feels so awkward to me to see, you know, like it makes they're going to be the most hated person on site. They are. Um, what, what do you see as new faces that we're going to start to see on events site, um, that maybe we haven't seen before, or aren't used to looking for?
Speaker 2 00:22:28 I think, I think in response to what we've just been saying, it's reasonable to expect that an event production house, the group responsible for producing the thing, um, would best be served by having a COVID or a, a viral, um, risk mitigation team, uh, as part of their duty of care. But I don't think it should stop with just the event producers and in, in my mind. And I think in, in the way we've been talking about it with respect to everything else on ESA, there are, you know, we, we work in a multi-stakeholder environment and of those multi-stakeholders each has their own duty of care. And in some instances, those duties of care overlap and a well-meaning well-intentioned professional cares about all of it, but may not carry the legal burden. Um, so it, for me, it's reasonable to expect that, uh, if I were producing a show of any kind music or otherwise I would have my own, uh, risk mitigation team around, uh, the COVID issue, uh, as much as I would around a rigging issue as a structural issue.
Speaker 2 00:23:51 Um, and I would expect that the venue, the housing of the, of the audience will have their own risk mitigation team. And, and arguably, if there were a promoter involved, I would, I would expect that the promoter agency would have its own risk mitigation team. The challenge then becomes all right, we all have our own, are we all following the same science? And are we investing in sharing our plans to ensure that what I expect to see when I arrive at the venue and the protocols in place at the venue have been communicated by me first off, and then have they been responded to, or does the venue have its own set of protocols in place that I can agree to? I don't think it's easier again, to point to the what, not to, not what not to assume. And I think in this instance, I don't think it's safe to assume that as an event producer, the whole burden is on the venue or the whole burden is on the artist.
Speaker 2 00:24:50 Uh, this is going to be a shared problem as is gravity, uh, for all of us. And we are, we should all be in this together in order to get our industry back on its feet. And let's not forget our industry is, you know, the definition of that is, is rarely considered as broad as it is. It's the concession folks, it's the folks cleaning the venue. It's the folks driving the bus. It's the runners, it's the doctors, it's the airplanes, it's the hotels. In every instance, we're going to need to make sure that we've done our due diligence, that where we intersect with some other stakeholder, we all have a plan. And we all know what each other's plan is. It's a, it's a burden, it's a, it's an enormous burden is the wrong word. It's a challenge. And you know, for me, you know, that's one of those challenges that you hire a professional whose job it is to ensure that all those component parts are in place and as the leader, you're just empowering that professional to succeed. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:25:55 So then, all right, that brings up a fantastic question. This is brand new to everyone. So just like a new piece of equipment or something that got created, that's now in, in, in the, the nether verse of the live event industry, how do we establish the professionalism of people who can actually come out and do that? I mean, I don't think we're going to have doctors coming out and suddenly becoming, you know, roadies and, and people on the road to help us establish safety protocols and health and things like that. Um, are there ways that one people can get, you know, kind of certified might be the, not the right word, but help them like, okay, how can I become a professional to be able to help and assist in this new
Speaker 2 00:26:44 Vein within our industry? It's a, it's an important distinction that you're making is this job of COVID compliance, doesn't fall to the rigor. You know, it doesn't fall to the lighting crew chief. What does fall to them is adherence to whatever the protocols are, but the idea of establishing what compliance means and monitoring that compliance and enforcing that compliance absolutely has to come from a new, a new crew person that we've not seen before. And in some instances that's going to be more than one. It may be a team of five or 10, depending on the thing. Uh, recently there was a, uh, a V a live television thing done for the Latin music awards or, or something along those lines. And they had a team of five or six people out there monitoring COVID compliance, uh, and that was a non audience event. So, uh, so it is a, it is a particular skillset, which does require a particular set of training circumstances.
Speaker 2 00:27:52 Um, so that the individuals executing those skills actually know what they're doing. Yeah. Which brings me to a whole nother line of communication about the fact that I have had to prove nothing to anyone to get the job I have. And I buy I'm arguably in charge, which is backwards that I hope that someday we can collectively fix. But in the meantime, right now, we're talking about COVID. So what, what skills does a COVID compliance person, a COVID risk mitigator need to have with them, and where do they get them? Well, there's a lot of, there's a lot of pieces of this puzzle out there being taught at the moment. There's this COVID compliance officer that's been put together by, um, uh, the health teaching network, I think might be the name, uh, in, in California, that's basically around movie sets and film sets and broadcast sets it be for lack of a, an industry specific one.
Speaker 2 00:28:49 A lot of people are flocking to that. Training. Johns Hopkins is teaching a, um, a, uh, contact tracing class. And there are a couple of other entities I've seen forgive me for not knowing off the top of my head that are doing some components of this training. Uh, the immense safety lions has taken on the task of creating an all encompassing, uh, risk mitigation role that would include COVID, but we're looking further out over the horizon to what's the next thing. And what's the next thing it's taken us a minute to get it to market, but we think we're down the road. And hopefully before the year's out, we'll have a live event professionals training in this space that, that may become the benchmark for the rest of the industry. Uh, so, you know, common sense is the first rule, and you would hope that your COVID compliance person would have that.
Speaker 2 00:29:45 And then, you know, at the moment, go take everything you can, that's available to you out there and get as broadly trained as you possibly can. And I think you're right. I don't think it's officer, I think that that has a negative connotation around our circles. Um, and I, and I, and I, but I do think some of the job is policing compliance. Um, and I do think it's broader than just put your mask on temperature check, right? It's, it's a whole suite of services that have to be provided and monitored and maintained throughout, throughout an event day or week, whatever that might be.
Speaker 0 00:30:25 Yeah. Okay. I think that's great. Um, I look forward to seeing the stuff from the ESA. I mean, I'm, you know, I see the ESA really as the cornerstone of helping us establish a true safety framework around what we're doing, um, you know, and so whatever you guys come up with, I'm sure it'll be very, very robust and exceptionally full of all kinds of information. So excited to see that.
Speaker 2 00:30:51 Thanks, uh, Jordan, we hope we certainly hope to pull in all the good work that's being done and, and, and coalesce that into a larger training. It's not going to be a two hour class. It's going to take you a bit longer to get it, but it will be designed for event professionals of all ilk, wedding planners, meeting planners, con you know, you name it, uh, and it will speak, uh, the, uh, the lexicon of our language. And, um, and hopefully it will provide, you know, this person may be in the lead role of COVID compliance. Where are these other, this other training, uh, can speak to the, the additional workforce that that person might need to deploy?
Speaker 0 00:31:33 Yeah. Okay. I love that. Um, so the ESA is developing that sort of stuff. How, how can people get involved in the ESA? One to be kind of kept up to speed on all of the COVID, but then again, I mean, all of the other safety challenges that we face as we go back into events and, and then why should they get involved with the ESA?
Speaker 2 00:31:57 Uh, great question. The ESA is you, that was the first strap line that we had about the organization. Um, it took a lot of years of us getting our feet underneath us to demonstrate that. And, and, and one of the things that we were very precious about in the early years was that we knew the subject matter was difficult enough already let alone the fact that nobody really cared about it, and it was the least sexy subject in the business, and nobody wanted to have a finger wag at them. So we, we knew that, that the discussions coming from the ESA had to have a very particular tone to, in order to have any kind of adoption rate. So, you know, the first few years arguably up until the last couple, we were really precious about how we communicated. We believe we've kind of earned our place.
Speaker 2 00:32:52 Now we've proven to folks that we're here for the right reasons. We're Switzerland, when it comes to vendors and ideas and, and, and really anyone can contribute allowed the 300 plus folks who contributed to the reopening guide. Um, we've just added a handful of new directors to our board in order to, you know, to look at the world in a new place and accelerate our ability to have output as well as just think tanking stuff. And this year 2020 was going to be the year we took the show on the road and made it extremely accessible to our, our constituents. Uh, now the way we're going to do that is in December, we wanted to put a month between the election and our conference in December. We're going to do a virtual online conference for the world. And it'll be the first time we'd get to hear from a great many of our constituents that normally don't make to travel to the garden spot of Lititz Pennsylvania in November.
Speaker 2 00:33:55 So, uh, you know, we, no one should feel that the organization isn't accessible to them and everyone should feel that their input is valued because it is, uh, we can't begin to believe that we have all the answers. We simply don't. And every time we turn a corner, there's a new threat, there's new risks, there's a new need for an expert. And, you know, arguably COVID has done a lot to shine, a light on the need for the event safety Alliance. The guide, as I said, has been downloaded some 27,000 times already officially through our network. Um, so I, I, I take a little bit of pride in that. I think the organization should take some pride in that and continue to enlist help from around the industry.
Speaker 0 00:34:38 Very nice. What, um, what can the ESA do to help freelancers, to help companies? I mean, you guys are providing information. I mean, really, truly for the most part free of charge, other than the, the trainings that people can be a part of and go to, um, you know, what are some other things that the ESA is doing to help companies help freelancers to really kinda see, I guess, sound the alarm, if you will, on how we need to be safer so that people don't come in and, you know, like with COVID, something does happen suddenly you're going to have a whole bunch of agencies rushing in saying, Oh, we got to help them. Cause they don't know what they're doing. They don't know how to contain what's going on or how to bring things back. Um, what is, what can the event safety lines do or what are they going to do to kind of help push that forward? Kind of a really wrong backwards question.
Speaker 2 00:35:38 I mean, look, the events safety Alliance is a nonprofit advocacy group. So we survive on sponsorship and donations. Um, and we have one paid person in the organization then he's been run, you know, without him we'd have nothing. Uh, the, our, our, we do not provide safety as a service, just in case. Anyone's confused about that. We, we try to provide, um, guidance for our industry to follow. Uh, recently, I don't know if you're aware that the second iteration of the event safety guide is coming through a journey with the American national standards Institute. So the entire guide is being dissected and presented to the, to the auntie, uh, organization, uh, and becoming, you know, whatever iteration comes out. The other end of the ANSI sausage maker is our version two of the event, safety guide. Wow. And so far we've had two chapters make it all the way through the process that are now ANSI standards, that's crowd management and, and weather safety.
Speaker 2 00:36:38 Um, so, you know, what we, what can we do to help other organizations be safe? Well, I think we do that in the, in the work that we provide back to the industry for free. The guide is now available for free our event, safety access training, uh, is now at nine 95, uh, you know, because of COVID we wanted folks to be able to have access to that, and we don't think we'll ever raise that price back up again, knock wood. Um, uh, and the reopening guidance is absolutely free as well. We recognize that our mission is to the industry. Yeah. I think we do it already. I think people just have to come to the well and drink the water, drink the Kool-Aid right.
Speaker 0 00:37:23 Well, not the Kool-Aid let's stick to the water. Um, before we finish up, um, let's talk a little bit about show makers, the, the, the new non-profit venture that I've kind of started to see, take hold some of the podcasts wrong end of the snake, other kinds of stuff. I mean, that may not be part of it, but you guys have talked about it. Uh, you guys have been doing a bunch of webinars and other types of things with show makers, talk a little bit about show makers, the nonprofit, what it's doing, how it's trying to help the industry.
Speaker 2 00:37:54 So a great question, and I appreciate you asking Jordan, um, show makers, uh, was born the eye. The concept for show beggars was born about five or six years ago, and it was an on again, off again, idea that hadn't yet found its footing. Uh, and it was just prior to the realization, what COVID was going to do to our, our industry that show makers was getting ready to announce a live conference, uh, that obviously went by the wayside because of COVID. And, and, but the needs that we, the, the, we envision that show makers will resolve or attempt resolve on behalf of the industry, uh, are still still exist. And in fact, they've gotten even more attention in recent days. Uh, the intention for show makers is that it picks up the discussion where the event safety Alliance guardrails are. So that is to say, ESA is safety, specific safety centric by its charter.
Speaker 2 00:39:01 The things that we can teach and talk about and provide back to the industry are related to safety broadly. Uh, but there's a whole slew of things that our industry could do better. And, you know, should do better at that. We haven't before been challenged to do like financial literacy, like diversity equity and inclusion, you know, like, you know, asking its leaders, production managers, to our manager, stage managers, crew chief, to have some competencies in HR to have some soft skills, to have some leadership skills, as well as management skills, all of those things are important. And right now successful leaders in the industry have those things, but through fault, they got them ver via on the job training. We haven't asked our industry to demonstrate any and sees in its leaders, which has been fun, perhaps it's not the best way to do business.
Speaker 2 00:40:04 So, uh, you know, the sh show makers is intended to create a platform warm where thought leaders in the industry can come together. Uh, we'll be talking more about this in future podcasts, hopefully Jordan, because there's some right now that we're not ready to discuss, but, um, thought leaders around the industry would come together and define what does a stage manager, what competencies does a stage manager need to demonstrate, relate to carry that credential other than he's really good at he, or she's really good at riding a crew. Um, and how can we use those competencies to create a more resilient, more resilient business for ourselves? Meaning, geez, we're, we're better respected than we may currently be in places like the government where we can't seem to get a break for our, for our relief packages. Yeah. And, and that, and that our skills, because they're demonstrable through training are, are, are transferable to other places.
Speaker 2 00:41:03 What is it? Does that mean? Well, um, you know, right now, if you call yourself a roadie and there's a lot of greatness to that, does that mean you can then pick up and go do sports, even though lots of what's happening back behind the scenes is exactly this same thing. It might not translate. No. So, uh, you know, by, by installing industry, agreed upon criteria, creating a credentialing system and, and holding ourselves to a higher set of standards and accountability, we then make a more resilient workforce, you know, possibly we can find insurance, possibly we can find safety nets for the next pandemic. You know, possibly we can create a better place for our mental, our mental wellbeing to exist because currently we don't really pay that much attention. So, uh, it's our intention to have this be another organic organism that is Switzerland across the industry in an effort to create greener pastures for everyone. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:42:06 I think that's awesome. I mean, as much as I love telling people, I went to the school of hard knocks. It doesn't necessarily gain me any accolades other than great job, buddy. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:42:15 So, but I could unload 15 trucks in two hours. You really meet me. That's right. Skill to have. I mean, I miss it tremendous the guy, I don't know that I could ever do an eight hour day. Right. I don't feel fulfilled unless I've really done my due diligence. Right. It's how do we translate those skills, um, to a more respectable place? 16,
Speaker 0 00:42:39 18 hours are bust.
Speaker 0 00:42:44 Well, the way I end every single podcast is I ask, uh, whoever we're talking to that day, two things gig ready is the name of the podcast. Our goal is to help people be more gig ready. The next time they go to gig, whether that's tomorrow, next week, next month, or next year, um, to be more gig ready for the next time they go out. So what, from the standpoint of everything we've talked about today, what are two things that those people listening can say, okay, this is something I can do to be more gig ready. The next time I go out and gig around people, whether it be, you know, concert, whether it be festival, whatever that may be,
Speaker 2 00:43:28 Um, never stop learning, never, ever, ever stopped learning, be a sponge for everything that you can get your hands on. Um, I'm at my silver-haired age, still continue, continue to subject myself to online learning. In-person learning you name it. Uh, and, and I'm, I'm happy to say I'm both sad and happy to say that I continue to learn things about myself, about the way I've led in the past and the way I can be better in the future that, you know, I look back and wish that I had taken some of the training I've gotten now 20 years ago, so that I could have been a better leader for those around me. So, you know, number one, never stop learning and, you know, related directly to our industry. If you, if you can scrape together nine 95, go take the event. Safety Alliance say ISA training.
Speaker 2 00:44:23 It's a good, it's a toe in the water there make you feel good about yourself. It's, it's, uh, you know, basic training for safety. Uh, and you know, the feedback on that training is pretty good. Awesome. Uh, and I, and I think the other, the other thing, um, you know, my point number two would be, uh, compassion in that we have long held to a set of standards where lighting people, don't talk to sound people where, you know, if you are sick, you're shunned. If you can't do a 16 hour day, you know, you're broken, you know, if you're, if you're glum, uh, you're, you don't look mentally fit, you're broken. And I think the world has evolved. And certainly our, our working, um, uh, our working dynamic has evolved in that compassion is the most important perhaps on, on, on any job site. And, and that goes back to mask wearing as well.
Speaker 2 00:45:24 It's like, you know, you're going to wear the mask if you're working with me, because you need to demonstrate your compassion for everybody else who might get sick, if you don't. Right. But more importantly, we work in an out, we work in an atmosphere that degrades our mental health. It, we get tired, we get hungry. We, we live off of the dopamine rush every time the audience applauds or the house lights go out. Um, and, and that puts us on this rollercoaster that makes us already kind of vulnerable to the, to the work that we do, we end physically. So if, if we can all begin to think about what compassionate leadership looks like, what servant leadership looks like and embrace those ideals for each other. And I think that's a quick way to start changing the culture. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:46:15 I'd love just to quickly touch the servant leadership ideas, huge. Um, the, the, I work for you, not, you work for me, and if everybody can look that way and say, I work for you, even if it's someone who's on the same crew or someone who is below, you know, from the hierarchy standpoint, I mean, how much of a better industry would we have if everybody walked around with the, how can I help you? I'm here to help take care of you. I'm here to make your life better. It's not just about me, me, me, me, me, Oh, that's not my gig. Sorry, I'm just,
Speaker 2 00:46:52 That's a hundred percent right, Jordan and the trouble is it's an industry that's designed to inflame egos, and we're all guilty of that. And you know what, but what we see out over the horizon is exactly what you just described is that the real win is when we all win. The real win is when the runner goes home feeling as valued as the pop star. And, you know, and when the caterer goes home feeling as valued as the pop star and the bus driver and the truck driver and the travel agent and the hotelier and everybody we touch really, truly, we are, we deserve, they all deserve. We, we need to operate in a, in a thought process. I think in, in my view that they're all as important as the next person on the team. And, and we need to start building our teams and cultivating those kinds of constituents in our workforce that appreciate value those things and share those values, uh, as they go through their professional. And like, I'm only, I'm only now coming to this realization. That's not who I was or how I was, but man, it sure feels really good to be a servant leader. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:48:07 I'm with you, man. We need more of those people for sure
Speaker 2 00:48:10 Directly, but that has requirements as well, right? People need to know their roles and responsibility. They need to know, you know, these are, there's a whole Lew that needs to be taught in order to empower servant leadership. We need to teach some fundamentals about, um, making sure that what's called the hygiene level of everyone on the team is met first sleep food, you know, mental strength and paycheck. Those things have to be dealt with first and then we take it up a tier and then upper tier. And so
Speaker 0 00:48:39 That's awesome. I love the thoughts. Well, hopefully we can talk more about it in the future. Um, cause it's all stuff that's incredibly important to me, my team, those that work in, in the events industry in general, whether it's touring corporate, industrial doesn't matter. So, um, all great stuff. Thank you so much. Uh, I appreciate you taking the time to join me today and I had a great time. Thank you,
Speaker 2 00:49:02 Jordan. Thank you so much for, uh, even thinking to reach out and call and good luck with all the, all the work that you're attempting to do. Um, I'm also out of work. So if you're looking for somebody I'm available, uh, no, seriously, congratulations to your family and, and continuing to reset your sales. You know, we will never be able to change the storm that is this pandemic or, or whatever the next one is, but we can sail in a different room.
Speaker 0 00:49:29 Yes we can. Awesome, Jim. Well, thank you, sir. Appreciate it. And thanks for being on COVID has been the wrench in all of our plans. I know it hasn't been an easy six or seven months, but I'm confident that going forward, the future is going to be brighter for those of you that want to get better. Let's continue to work together each and every day to make sure that we are better tomorrow than we were today because that's what gig ready is all about. I can't wait to share more of these podcast episodes with you, and I really appreciate it. If you would go tell others, let them know about the gig ready podcast and how they can get involved. We want to give you as much information, share as much value with you as we can. So please email me gig
[email protected] so that we can get better every day. Thanks again for listening. And remember you're only as good as your last gig.
Speaker 1 00:50:24 <inaudible>.
