Speaker 0 00:00:00 Welcome to today's show. Thanks for being here. I'm excited to have you here. We've got a great conversation coming up for you before we get started, though, I asked two things real quick. Number one, if you feel like you've gotten value, you've gotten better. You have increased in your knowledge. You've learned something, anything of that nature, let your friends, your colleagues, your professionals around, you know, you're at the next gig. Tell them, Hey guys, check out the gig, ready podcast. Those guys are doing some cool stuff over there. I learned this. I learned that. I'd love to have you tell someone else about us. Secondly, if you've got something that you would love to hear about or share or know about, or get better at, let me know gig
[email protected]. Shoot me an email. Say, Hey Jordan, here's what's going on. Here's what I've got for you. Here's a great idea. Here's something I'd like to hear about or someone I'd like to hear from, or maybe you'd like to be on the show. You think, you know what? I would enjoy that that'd be a great time. Let me know, shoot me an email. It'd be awesome. I'd love to have you thanks so much for listening because this is the gig ready podcast.
Speaker 1 00:01:05 <inaudible>
Speaker 0 00:01:21 Hey everybody. We're here today with Clem Harrod of Clem co and uh, talking about all things, projection and video, quite excited to have him here. Clem actually just finished writing a book talking to, uh, not just projectionists, but anybody in the industry that has, uh, questions about the financial side, uh, how to work in this industry. It fits right into what we're trying to do, which is talk about the people, the passions, the positions within, uh, the audio visual industry. Clem, thank you so much for taking the time to join us today. Super happy to have you here. Uh, I'm really excited about our time together today.
Speaker 2 00:02:02 Oh, Jordan, thank you for having me here. You know, I'm honored to be on your show. I'm just the guest. So thank you.
Speaker 0 00:02:10 W we are in the humble beginnings of working to teach people how to be better, uh, in the industry, how to be, as I say, gig ready. Um, because ultimately we're going to have another gig, even though we're not gigging right now. And, um, I, you know, I'm excited for the future and what that holds, how we can get better. Um, so, you know, as we dive in looking at projection in, and of it, you know, as a profession, as a career, however they want to term it. Um, every event is a little bit different, whether it's one single screen, 10 screens, a hundred screens, blends mapping, all of that. Um, when you come into a project as a projectionist, you're normally not involved directly from the beginning. You know, a lot of times people say, Oh, here's the drawing. This is what we're doing. How do you make it work? Um, how do you see your role within the whole team as a projectionist and, and how you're going to execute on, uh, the end goal of which is to create a great show?
Speaker 2 00:03:16 Um, well, one of the first things that I do is I take ownership. I take ownership of my parts of the experience. You know, when you think about what a sales person has done is they sold an experience and then you get the creative people involved and you get the technical director involved, you get all these different departments and these different people involved to take what was here in that right side of the brain that create a place and taking, taking it to the left side, to create the structure around it. And now we are using our skills and our talents to allow people to come inside of our world. Okay. That's how I view what it is that we do now. Now with that as a video projectionist, it is my responsibility to understand the video projection aspect of that event. So how many screens, how many projectors, the throw distance, the power, the cable path, all of those things are now important for me as part of my job as a video projection, as some of that event. Um, and, uh, you know, that's kind of, that's the first step for me. It's like, okay, what is our objective? What is our goal? How much time do we have to create this vision that someone else has had? And now I take the time through my process to understand my part in executing that.
Speaker 0 00:04:39 Awesome. So let's talk about the process a little bit. If you had your druthers, uh, the perfect scenario, how would you manage a project from start to finish? You know, where, how do you start it from the moment someone says, Hey, come on in and be a part of this. You're now on the team to boom, last truck doors closed and the gears headed back to the shop.
Speaker 2 00:05:02 Uh, well, so I'd like to reverse kind of something that you said, like you said, if I had my perfect situation, well, it's my job to create my perfect situation. Well said, I love that. It's that, it's that understanding from the beginning? You know, I don't deal in expectations. I deal in agreements. So if you're working with me or working with my company, um, whether I'm on site or one of my video projectionists or any other, um, um, technicians that are helping your events, we are a part of your team. We're not just showing up and doing the job. We're understanding what needs to happen from the beginning. So there are documents that I'm requesting from the drawings, from the production schedule, from the equipment list. Those are the things that are important to get the job done. Those are the things that we need to look at.
Speaker 2 00:05:53 Those are the things that we need to dissect and understand and have that relationship, have that conversation with the, um, um, various crew members and the people involved in the planning. You know, I'm not trying to come in at the last minute and then be expected to work a miracle. That's not what we do. That's not how we operate at Clem co. Um, because we are a part of, we are an extension of your brand. You know, we have our own brand and we have our own way of coaching, leading, educating, and mentoring. But at the same time, your company has its mindset has its, um, way that it likes to deal with its customers. And we fall under that at the same time, we're trying to do our best to deliver that high end product that you deserve and your client deserves.
Speaker 0 00:06:36 Awesome. So taking ownership as you stayed first thing out the gate, um, so let's walk through that process of, you know, assessment planning into, uh, execution onsite. What, what does that process look like for you when you guys, uh, execute on each job?
Speaker 2 00:06:55 Okay. Um, so, you know, this is, these are the things that I've written about in my video projection one Oh one, uh, books. So I have career projection in my video projection one Oh one book. I literally go through this into higher.
Speaker 0 00:07:10 Got it.
Speaker 2 00:07:14 I frame it. Um, and it's just like, it's just taking those documents, taking the what's, the givens, right. We all have givens in this situation, the venue, um, the people involved, the crew size, the number of screens, the number of projectors, like I said, the throw distance, um, front or rear projection, isn't, there's an analyzing of the documents, which projectors are we using? Um, do we have the appropriate lenses? Do we have the appropriate power, the signal, all of those, this like a mental checklist. And there's another checklist involved that, um, um, involved in understanding the process, understanding what we have and what we need, um, you know, thinking about networking, are we networking? The projectors together is just, it's so many steps. And that's just through years of experience, right through years of knowing that this is what, uh, what prevented the event from being at least on my part, what prevented the event from being as successful as I wanted?
Speaker 2 00:08:21 Yes, it was still successful, but what could I have done better? What could I, what, what's another step that I could have taken to allow me to communicate with the stage hands, um, better to delegate some of the tasks that need to be done for me to have done things in a more timely manner. How much more time do I need to do on the pre-production side before coming on site? You know, all of these things are kind of going through my mind as I'm looking at the documents, preparing them, um, leading the team, looking at projectors as they're coming in, separating them, knowing where, what, what, um, uh, projector lumens or bright or, um, brand model, whatever is going to various locations on site. Uh, that's just kind of, you know, what I inherently had to learn and I had great mentors. Um, I ha I've had great mentors in the industry.
Speaker 2 00:09:13 Uh, Phil Akari, uh, Melvin Legrand, Stuart Brown, Jerry Farnum, uh, Mike Swinton. Um, I'm sure there's some others. Um, and, and, and those are just video projectionists, you know, I mean, I could go on the side of the engineers from, uh, Robert Perminter, Ben Stanfield, Tim <inaudible>. Um, so many people that have just allowed me to understand what it is that they do, uh, Matt Ellis, um, Rick Wagner, you know, how they do their parts, how they do their tasks and how, what I do helps them, which overall helps the client. Right. And so now just working together to really, um, have a, have a wonderful event,
Speaker 0 00:09:57 Of course, I mean that ultimately is the goal, a client walking away saying, wow, that was better than we could have ever expected it to be. And, uh, so we come in from the beginning. Um, tell me a little more about these documents that you're using to stay organized. Uh, as you mentioned, you have a video projection, a one Oh one, a book that I go through the step-by-step process. What are you using? I mean, of course we all get the drawings, vector works. Um, you know, how do you keep that all organized in your head, especially on a bigger job. Um, you know, two screens is pretty straightforward, you know, but you get into the bigger job with the multiple delays and screens and all that stuff. What are you doing to help keep yourself organized?
Speaker 2 00:10:46 So I don't, I don't want to come off like a sales guy, right. I, so the video projection, the video projection textbook was based is based off of the video projection work. Okay. So I literally have a binder that has my standard operating procedures, all written out with dividers, and it has in, it has a, um, Excel document as well. That helps that I use as part of my checklist process and keeping myself organized and thinking about the bill, that the notebook in, in a, uh, uh, in an organized fashion, so that when I do go out on site, I have my drawings, I have my, my, um, equipment list and my production schedule, like those things are with me. Those things are my Bible for the week, right? Those are the things that I've looked at. Those things that I've studied prior to getting on show site, I've already, I've already executed and I've already built everything in my mind. When I go on show site, I'm just recreating what I've already done. So for those of you
Speaker 0 00:11:54 That don't want to have to burn a bunch of time coming up with your standard operating procedures, cleanse the guy he's got the info for you. Um,
Speaker 2 00:12:02 You know, I mean, because, and the only reason I did that, the only reason I did that was because like, when I would go on job sites and I would go on show sites and working with certain people, and they're walking in the door for the first time, looking at a drawing, once the TV rolls it out, they have no idea what they're doing beforehand. Well, how can we be efficient? How can we execute something to the best of our ability? How can we minimize double work? Well, I mean, right, that's the worst doing double work when we could've just done it right the first time.
Speaker 0 00:12:32 And if you take a lesson, you know, take it take a page from the master electrician workbook. I mean, that's ultimately what, you're, what you're doing. I mean, you're looking at, you're doing the pre show. Um, you know, in the case of the master electrician, there's, uh, there is a significantly tends to be a lot more planning because they have, you know, they could have 300 fixtures and you might have 30. So, you know, there's a balance there of, of what's different, but, uh, it's, it's exactly the way to do it. Well. Um, you know, and that's another thing to have a conversation about it in the future is certain people, um, you know, being able to find that pre-show time being able to take some of that free time when you're sitting backstage, staring at a projector to make sure it's working and taking that extra time to look for your next job and look at the next job so that you're better prepared. You're ready for that gig or gig ready, uh, throw a little plug in there for
Speaker 2 00:13:32 Nice, nice. I see what you did there,
Speaker 0 00:13:35 Have your documents, binder, all that stuff. I, I think it's outstanding and fantastic to, to put something like that together. I have a whole list as a technical director. That's like, you know, massive Excel spreadsheet, big enough, you know, it's like, okay. And, and it gets really granular. It's like, okay, here's, pre-show list of all the things that need to be checked. Like these are the things that should be done with places to next to them. Okay. This is how I did this. This is the info regarding this. I mean, if all we try and do is do it from memory, we'll never remember everything I've tried to do that. Um, you know, I'm sure when you were younger before you got wise and put everything down on paper, you were doing the same thing. You're like, Oh crap. You know, and you show up and you're like, Oh, no, I needed that, that Dogbone, that converted the four pin to the three pin for the projector. And, uh, you know, now I gotta make it onsite and you're wasting time and all that sort of stuff. Um, w w what other, uh, documents or software solutions, is there anything else you're using to stay organized, uh, or to just execute on your job? Like for instance, throw ratio, uh, projector, lenses, you know, what do you use to make sure that you're picking the right lens for the job and having the proper equipment there?
Speaker 2 00:14:47 Yeah. Um, so I want to go back to something you mentioned, like, so there was a, there's an, a master electrician. Uh, his name is, um, uh, Eric, Eric Durney. He was, uh, he is a master electrician that I would bounce ideas off of because I saw how organized he had to be. And I saw certain things about the process. And I began to ask him in question, because that's something that, that did make sense to me. And I'm looking around like, why are no other projection is doing this? Why are no other video projection is looking, thinking about it from this perspective? And it just made sense to me. So, yeah. Shout out to Eric, Eric Durning and Richard Dunn, um, for, for, for helping me to understand that. And so some of the programs that I do use to help continue on with my process are the various, um, you know, um, lens calculator or throw distance apps that you can easily get.
Speaker 2 00:15:40 I'm I, I'm an iOS Donna Guy, Apple guy, but I'm sure they're available on the Android platforms from projectionists, from, um, the Alfred, uh, Y Y lens calculator. Yeah, for sure. Yup. Yup. Um, uh, Panasonic has their lens calculator as well. There's another one. I think it's by, uh, I liked it. I keep it right here in this specific folder. Lens pro is one that I use often, but I was going to say, you know, those, those, those things are key. Those things are key, but onto one, in addition to that, just the same way that you can use, uh, Microsoft office, or excuse me, Microsoft word, to type a word document, you should be able to use Excel the exact same way and learning formulas and stuff like that. Vectorworks viewer is very important for me. I intentionally have not purchased the, um, you know, the program because I like using the viewer so that I can teach other people through my platform, how to use the viewer. So they don't feel like they need to invest in, um, uh, Vectorworks itself, because there are certain things as a video projection is that I can do from the viewer that are just as, uh, that are, that are key to allow me to be successful.
Speaker 0 00:16:58 Nice. I like that. Um, you know, helping people to succeed that way, uh, there are very basic tools that we have available to us already to accomplish those, uh, those sorts of jobs. I think that's outstanding. Um, so software, uh, documents documenting everything. I mean, as a technical director, I lean on my guys, uh, tremendously to, you know, projectionist. If I know who that's going to be, I'll send them all the documents and say, Hey, make sure I have what I need. Um, because I'm not the guy that's executing on that. I want to allow them to own that. I want to say, Clem, here's the, here's the design. This is what we're doing. Uh, here's the video poll list. This is the current quote. What do we need? Is there something on here we don't have, um, you know, I want you to have that power to say, Hey, Jordan, I need an extra 500 feet of L six 30 to power these projectors over here.
Speaker 0 00:17:57 I mean, you know, there's no service loop. The guys didn't, you know, add enough cable for a service loop because then we get on site and suddenly everything's tied together and I'm saying, Clem, why can't this trust go up? And you're saying, well, we didn't have enough cable. Uh, I want to avoid that at all costs. So that's, that's outstanding. Um, so let's talk about the onsite side of things. You're prepared. You've made all your notes, you've reviewed all the documents. You come onsite, you walk in, you know, 8:00 AM, call time, uh we're at whatever hotel suits your fancy for that day. Um, you know, how are you managing the project onsite? What are you looking for in terms of you're working with people direction? Are you a super hands-on guy? Are you a hands-off like delegate kind of guy walk, talk to me a little bit about how you do, how you do the onsite side of things when it comes to projection.
Speaker 2 00:18:50 Yeah. Um, I'm a, I'm a mixture. I'm a hybrid, I'm a hybrid. There are certain things that I definitely delegate because those things, those, those tasks, aren't the best use of my time. You know, that's why we have stage hands. That's why we have people who are there to assist us at projection assist. Right? If I, if I've already, like I said, if I already built it and built it here and it's my job to be gone site and execute it again. Um, and my, and my situation, um, or from my perspective, then there are things that I already know that need to be done. And so I'm delegating, um, the, uh, off to say chance for them to grab, gather certain cables. You know, these are the cables that I need, and this is what I need them to be labeled as right. I'm not gonna go do that because there are other things that I need to do as far as organizing my projectors and knowing where they need to go out for the trust, you know, in the house or backstage, like making sure that we have all the lenses there, there are things that I need to do understanding talking with the technical director, even though I've already done it, you know, before we got on site to confirm the cable paths, because there are things that there are, there are always variables and things could have changed.
Speaker 2 00:20:01 And those things may not have been, um, made known to me just yet. So I'm reconfirming some of the things that need to be done. Um, and then just, you know, kind of building that rapport as well with some of the other technicians that I haven't met, you know, cause we're, we're in this together, we're working together and I don't want to come in as a guy that's straight up about business and this is, this is what we're doing. And when we're getting this done, that's not my job. That's not how I operate. That's not how I function. That's not what I've done all these years to be successful. You know, I genuinely want to get to know people and understand what's their drive, what's their motivation. And, uh, how we're in for all of us to understand how we're in this together. Um, you know, so then running out some cables, you know, I'll work on the team, work on that with the team because I want to make sure they're done right.
Speaker 2 00:20:44 And they understand what it is that we're doing. Um, it comes to reeking up the projectors. I'm very, hands-on on that with that because there's a liability factor, the liability issues. I'm not going to just delegate that and be hands-off because at the end of the day, I'm responsible and not just from a liability perspective, but from a brand perspective, like when, when, when you're one of your event and there's a presenter on the stage and he's given his presentation, right. I know that he's put his all, he's put time and effort into that presentation, right? And now there's an audience of people looking at that screen and looking at him because that's a representation of him, the way I approach it is if you're looking at a screen, that's a representation of me. When you see that screen, you see me because that's my body of work. That's my all, I'm putting my all into that, into that screen. And that's what, you know, part of that mindset is that's what that projection one Oh one mindset is. I'm going to break it down to the basics and help everyone to understand the basics and understand what it is that we're doing. So then we can build upon that and move forward in that mindset.
Speaker 0 00:21:56 And every single piece of what we're doing is, is critical. Um, you know, giving a hundred percent, making sure that every, every PR you know, a projector even off, you know, two degrees can cause a challenge for you. It's like, I'm the technical director coming to you saying, why, why are we still working on this one projector? And you don't want to be the guy to tell me, well, I let the stage hands do you know? I mean, ultimately, it's you, when you have to take responsibility for what you're doing, uh, you know, being involved and, and learning,
Speaker 2 00:22:28 And, and, and I'm, I'm always going to take responsibility, right? I'm not going to blame it on this stage. And then ultimately that stage Hannah ever, like, I'm not, I'm not even saying it's stage and as, as a degrading thing, but who these various people fall under my leadership. And if I have led them astray that I'm gonna take ownership and responsibility for not leading them in the right direction. Right.
Speaker 0 00:22:51 Um, you know, it, uh, it takes, it takes a lot of guts to be willing to do that and take on that responsibility. And I would say that in the industry, um, I would say, I don't want to say 50%, but a lot of people like to try and pass the buck when there are mistakes. I think that's probably one of my biggest frustrations about what we do is everybody is trying to cover their butt. Um, instead of being someone who is willing to step up and say, you know what? I screwed up, that's on me. Um, I know that I'm kind of changing the w w the, the direction there, but, you know, I, I, I, I would much rather somebody like yourself who says, you know, what, every single thing is under, it may not be completely under my control, but it's under my responsibility.
Speaker 0 00:23:41 And when we take that on, um, that think is one of the big components of learning how to work in our industry is the ability to just take responsibility for your screw ups and know that if you're around a group of people that understand that you're not going to get fired the first time you, you make a mistake. And I think that there's a stigma in our industry that says you screw up, you're done. Um, and, and you're going to be thrown to the wayside. And I mean, I've learned that the best leaders within our industry are the people that say, okay, we learned from that, we're moving onto the next thing. And they actually give more grace. They give more chance to people to actually learn, because firing somebody for screwing up doesn't actually really help you in any way. It just means that you put someone else there that has no clue what's going on, versus somebody who can come in or was there. I should say, they mess up. They say, okay, we learned from this, we're not going to do this next time. And then they actually can execute on that going forward, um, and, and be more productive and do a better job, um, then,
Speaker 2 00:24:51 But Jordan, just think about it from this perspective as well. If you are able to share that with someone, someone made a mistake, right? W w we're putting it in air quotes. It's not a mistake. It's just, it's an opportunity to teach. Yep. Right. If someone did something that wasn't as favorable as you would have liked, right. And you realize that you have an opportunity to help them to learn how to fix that error. You have the ability to change the trajectory of that person's life based off of that one opportunity, that one situation, yeah. Their entire life, which then affected their life and affects their kids' lives or whomever's life. Like you have the ability to change generations by just by educating someone,
Speaker 0 00:25:39 Man, you could not be more right about that. I, you know, one of the things that I've always, uh, and this is just me being vulnerable, that I've always had trouble with is having those hard conversations with people, um, about something that is so personal, like failure, um, or perceived failure, I should say, you know, um, I heard this quote a few weeks ago by a guy named Zig Ziglar. He said, failure is an event. It's not a person. And being able to separate yourself from that failure, um, and understand that it's not who you are. It's merely something that happened is, is such a great springboard to help people know that when I come to them and I say, Hey, listen, this was not ideal or preferred. Um, next time let's do this. Instead, that way they're like, Whoa, I didn't just get screamed at or yelled at.
Speaker 0 00:26:37 I didn't get run into the ground and say that I was a terrible person. And I'm horrible. Um, you know, I've run into those people and it's not fun. I mean, it ruined me for, um, uh, I actually had some situations back when I was younger, where for years it like ruined my confidence, my ability to do my job. I mean, everything. Cause there was one thing that happened and that basically they ran it, they ran me into the ground and, and thankfully I was able to kind of overcome that, but it took way more time than them saying, Hey, I love how you said that this was not the preferred method or this was not the ideal way to do this here. It wasn't necessarily a failure, but let's, you know, let's do this better on this next one and boom it. And then now suddenly they're like, Holy crap. Like, yeah, maybe I messed up, but we have way more opportunity now to do it better next time. So
Speaker 2 00:27:32 I love
Speaker 0 00:27:32 That. Well, nice little,
Speaker 2 00:27:35 But you know, and that was the last little said
Speaker 0 00:27:38 That's the rabbit trail, but go ahead. No, I keep going.
Speaker 2 00:27:42 Yeah, no, I mean th I mean, and that's really, that's the reason why I wrote my book, uh, career projection one Oh one, as you can see projection one Oh one is a running theme in what it is that I do. Um, cause that's what that's kind of our model. That's what we live by. That's what I live by and my company being an extension of me. Right. Um, but that's why I wrote my book career projection one Oh one, because I felt like a failure in certain aspects of, uh, my career, you know, as, as a technician and as a camera operator, you know, I did 15 years in sports, had a wonderful career. I've done college national championships, I've done NBA finals, NBA all-star games, um, uh, world series, baseball, world series, Stanley cup finals, you know what I mean? I've done all of these great things.
Speaker 2 00:28:35 I've worked for fortune 100 companies doing events, traveling abroad, seeing parts of the country in the world that I never thought that I would, I would, I would see. Right. But in all of that, because of my lack of knowledge and my lack of education, I was not prepared as a business owner. Right. As an independent contractor, as a sole proprietor, I am a business owner, right. So I did 15 years as an independent contractor before I left the sports industry. And I even trained my replacement. I trained the person that was going to take my spot because I was camera three that's. I was under that basket at a magic game. You saw that position, you saw me and I owned it, right. Just like I own every single job, but doing that and giving my all to the, to the companies, to Fox the Turner, Fox sports Turner, Espen, you know, ABC sports, whomever came to town.
Speaker 2 00:29:34 I gave my all to that project, but at no point was I investing back in my cell at no point was I thinking, I need to think long-term when my mind and my body begins to reject the work that I'm doing, how will I be taking care of them? Right. And so I felt like a failure at that because I wasn't prepared when I left, you know? And so in that, in that understanding and that mindset and as a technician, would I reverse engineer the problem? Okay, this was the issue. This was the problem. How do I go back to fix the problem? And what do I need to know if I were to go back to my childhood? Or, I mean, yeah. I mean, I started off literally going back to my childhood. I did, that's all I taught in my book. I'm talking about, um, my grandfather and my mother a little bit and their roles as an artist and, uh, independent contractors in a sense, and how that led to me walking into this, right.
Speaker 2 00:30:30 Or them being in a W2 world as well, and not knowing and teach, being able to teach me all of this, but I had to find this information out for myself. So to prevent someone else from going through that lecture or that hardship, I started having those difficult conversations. Yeah. Right. I started having those difficult conversations on a show side. So instead of talking about to somebody, so what, you know, what's your next gig or how you've been doing, you've been busy, you know, instead of talking about, then instead of talking about the traditional surface things, I wanted to be able to produce a body of work that could change the trajectory and change the life of someone else. And essentially my younger self. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:31:12 That's awesome. Let's, let's go to the other side of it. So you have the person who, you know, there's something they can do better. How do you approach that person? That individual, because that's, I mean, that's a really hard navigation, especially if it's someone maybe you don't know very well, you're not their buddy, you know, my friend, I can come over and, you know, put us up, put my armor on and be like, bro, that was that wasn't very sharper. Like, you know, there's a little bit more joking. How do you approach that with somebody that you don't necessarily know very well, um, to have that really tough conversation of, Hey, listen, I'm not mad at you, but this can't happen again.
Speaker 2 00:31:51 Yeah. Um, come, come to it with an open heart, come, come to it from a soft perspective and let this person know that like, just be vulnerable within yourself. Like, don't let this person, you're not walking up to this person as if you're God or you're the almighty never making any mistakes. Right? Yeah. I had to make mistakes like, and I'm just trying to help you to be better. Like I'm not getting on you about what you did wrong. This is an effort to help you to be better for the future. And you know, what the future could do is, is in that conversation, that future is the next task you have that person do. Because now in that very next task, they're going to think about what it that they did and how they could be better. And then at the same time, um, you're building that comfort, that comfort level and that rapport with them as well. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:32:49 And how do you, um, from a mental standpoint, you know, let's say most, I would say most people are receptive when you approach humbly, when you approach it with the idea of, you know, I'm human too. I I've made so many, you know, that I can count. I can't even count the amount of mistakes I've made, but you know, when somebody doesn't respond favorably in that scenario, what do you do? What's your mental process when someone's like, whatever man, like, it was just that one time it was that one thing, like they get, they, they get real Hottie and angry and frustrated that you approach them about something that they did wrong, feeling like you're attacking them. What, what is your cause? You can't really say anything to that person. It's not like you can be like, well, you should really listen to me like that doesn't, that doesn't work. What's your mental process to kind of rebound from, uh, from that kind of scenario.
Speaker 2 00:33:45 Yeah. I, uh, it's just understanding that we're all human and, you know, I it's, a lot of times I'll internalize it and I'll think about how could I have communicated better? What could I have done to make that situation a little less, um, anxious for that individual? Cause the person felt threatened. The person felt threatened about how I was approaching them. So how can I do my job better and communicate my message to them in a better way. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:34:12 Awesome. A great way to look at that and a little self-reflection and learning how to, um, ultimately it's, I can't even think of the word right now. Um, self-awareness of what you're working on, what you're doing. Um, and self-awareness is, uh, is a trait that is very tough to learn. Um, I've, I've discovered in this industry, not only myself, not, you know, not being supremely self-aware, but then other people, um, you know, that, that are learning how to be self-aware within what they're doing. And um, the more we can help people to get into that, like, Hey, look at what did I do? How can I do it differently? Because like that's where the humility comes from in the first place. It's like, my goal is to, to help somebody else get better. But, you know, man, I gotta look right here first and foremost.
Speaker 0 00:35:07 I mean, for me, every show that I do, um, you know, whether it's sitting on the plane or I just finished closing the truck and I'm walking back to my room or whatever, like I'm thinking about what are the things that I should have, how could I have done, even if it was a great show, you know, maybe I could have, uh, you know, maybe it was maybe in the advanced process, I could have done XYZ better or uh, you know, maybe I could have shaved 20 minutes off the load in because we did, you know, we weren't moving the stage at the right or we weren't and yeah. Did it affect anything? Did it cost anybody extra money? No. Uh, but ultimately we want to be as efficient. We want to be as, um, you know, as good as we possibly can be. Um, you know, of course we travel a lot. We do a lot of work long hours, long days. Um, um, what are the things that you're traveling with when you're going from gig to gig? What are, what are the things that you, uh, that you traveled?
Speaker 2 00:36:08 Um, well, I, I obviously have my work box. Right. I've got my tools, but that's just whatever. Right. Everybody has their tools. Um, but when I actually chat, one of the most important things that I travel with is my ambience kit. Okay. You know, like you said, okay, like let's this,
Speaker 0 00:36:28 No, I know exactly what it is. I spent more than enough days touring with some, with some good friends that like they have, they have their carpet, they have the, you know, I mean everybody's a little bit different, but they have their coffee maker or their incense, or they're like the little light or, you know, what is, what is your kit look like?
Speaker 2 00:36:48 Um, so for me yet I have a, uh, it's called an Aurora light. Okay. So it's, you know, it has a variance variation, the colors, and then it has like a little movement on top of it. So you feel like you're underwater. Oh, okay. Right. And then, so then there's my, um, changing up light bulbs, right. In like a hue of blue purple blue are my two or my preferred colors. So I kind of spread those evenly throughout the room. I have multiple do a little scarf action, you know, a little candle just to kind of create that, that scent, that, that smell, and always have my, um, my, uh, Bluetooth, uh, what approved your buds? You know, it's just, I like to create an environment that feels like home, right. If I'm traveling, then I want to feel like I'm home, no matter where I go, it's just an extension of everything is an extension of me, extension of my comfort extension of my Haven. And so even when I'm walking, like I have a bubble around me that is my Haven and my safe space and I will welcome people in and out and I'll throw little supports parts of that bubble out as well. But it's just the, it's just, uh, just trying to create and sustain a place of comfort as we travel around the world. Um, giving parts of ourselves and our souls to the people in the, the events that we do. That's all
Speaker 0 00:38:08 Awesome. So are those, I assume that those are like the next, the next question of course is the top three things that you need on every show. Um, are those the three things or they're like the things that you have to have at every show that, uh, are, you know, like these are the top three things I need to have. Is it the Aurora light and that the stuff you put in your room, are there other things there?
Speaker 2 00:38:32 Um, top three, no, it's pretty much that. I mean, it's pretty much stays in a bag, you know, six in a bag ready to go. Awesome. That's the top three? I mean, I mean, obviously like not falling, just to stay connected with the family. I got to stay connected with family and the kids, um, through the various messaging, trying to stay on top of my schedule. Um, I don't travel with a Bible in hand per se, but I've got my app, you know, the kind of keep me grounded and keep me connected. Um, it's hard to say what a, a top read things in that are because all of it is just one and that's just kind of how our role, if you will. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:39:18 Yeah. It's all one package. You hire a Clem co, this is
Speaker 2 00:39:22 The whole deal. It's all coming with it, right. I mean this and this whole conversation, you know? Sure. As you can see, you know, it's just, this is all Clem call. This is, this is not just an extension of me, but this is anybody who's, you know, working under my brand. This is an extension of who we are, and this is what we kind of, you know, what I believe, and this is how we work. Yep.
Speaker 0 00:39:46 A hundred percent. And consistency is key. Um, you know, I have another good friend, that's a technical director and we've talked about this before the process of the travel and going from one place together. And he, he is very, um, religious is like the right. It's kind of the way to say it, but he's very regimented about what he does and the process and what that looks like. It's like, okay, I go from here to here and I do it this way. And then I do it this way. And I unpack my bag when I get to my room. And I do, you know, because you want it to feel not only feel, but you need that familiarity to be able to settle your mind and do good work, um, and do the, the, the stuff that we've been asked to do in a place that's unfamiliar to us.
Speaker 0 00:40:30 Um, and so I think that that is a, that's critical now as a freelancer projectionists, how are you finding work? And maybe now you don't need to, I mean, everybody just calls you, boom. It's like, phone's ringing off the hook all the time, but when you need to go out and find work when you need it, or when you were younger and you were just getting started, what are the things that you did to, um, you know, expand your network, help people know you do what you do and you do it well and, and give them a way to find, uh, find you and, and get more work as a freelancer.
Speaker 2 00:41:06 Yeah. Um, so that, that is actually one of the chapters in my book. Um, you know, how do I get new clients? Um, that's I wrote two chapters actually on that subject, chapter two is how do I get clients? Chapter four is how do I build and maintain relationships, right? So there's, there's multiple strategies. There's multiple ways to look at it. Um, I think a lot of people just kind of need to do what's true to themselves and true to who they are, uh, whether that's, whether that's networking on social media, whether that's networking on in person, whether that's going to the bar, whether that's, um, you know, doing other things outside of work, you know, just doing different things. Whatever's true to who you are to maintain that relationship and to build that rapport. Um, and to build that, that, that trusting sense where people understand, you understand your work ethic and understand and trust that you will do a good job on show site. That's what it really is. It's a matter of building trust with someone so that they know that you will be successful at what they ask you to do.
Speaker 0 00:42:14 Yeah. A hundred percent. Um, I love that. That's great. Uh, what is the toughest job you've ever done? Um, as a freelancer that just,
Speaker 2 00:42:27 Yeah, something with a lot of hours, a whole lot of hours. Cause you know, I guess I'm giving my all to an event, right. And so there's a short load end process, um, a long event, shorty load in process where I'm forced to give so much of myself in a, in a, in a, um, dedicated period of time where you're pushing it to the limit. Um, you know, that's hard, it's hard, you know, I think about, you know, loading at a show and having some technical issues with a computer and having to call someone else in to kind of make sure that it's done in time, but I had to do a hundred foot curved screen and load it all in ready for rehearsals in 24 hours, you know, and double stack projectors and flown all that's blown. You know, it's a lot, it was a lot to do, um, in warping, all of that. But at the end of the day, just get it done, you know, pull together the team to pull together the efforts and we get the job done. So even in a difficult old show, a challenging show, you learn how to do it better and make a positive out of a negative or never see it as a negative in the first place. Okay.
Speaker 0 00:43:33 Right. And you did it in 12 hours anyways, right? I mean, that was 24. That was, that was like the extra time that you didn't need. Right.
Speaker 2 00:43:44 Hey man, whatever it takes to get the job done.
Speaker 0 00:43:46 And now I'm at, I know, uh, that's, that's a tough one man. A hundred foot curve. Was it a full hundred? Was it a full, 180 degree like that? Or was it a, was it a, was it a softer curve than that?
Speaker 2 00:43:58 Uh, it was pretty wrestle curve. That was a pretty aggressive curve. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:44:04 Well that's a tough one. Well, good. Well, good on you, man. That's awesome. Fantastic. Um, what, uh, what do you like the most about what we do being a projectionist? Um, not just part of a team, but what do you like the most? What drew you to like step away from sports, uh, and move into projection?
Speaker 2 00:44:26 The opportunity to grow opportunity to do something different as a camera operator? I was on the, I was in the environment. I was in the middle of it all. And to move up from where I was, I was already at a very high point in my career to move up, is to move in the truck. I didn't want to leave the environment. I don't want to leave. I didn't want to leave being in the midst of the fans in the midst of the event, the sports. Um, and so yeah, just kind of felt like, okay, it's time I can move on. I can move on and moving over here, there's more opportunity. Um, I can make more money in a shorter period of time. Right. Which minimizes the amount of time that I'm away from my family and allows me to be more focused on that event during that period of time.
Speaker 2 00:45:05 And when I'm done, I can be with my family. Um, who's my son's ready in the other room where it's like, dad, what's going on. Uh, but you know, th you know, that's who I am right now. Right. I gave a lot of myself to my career to getting to this point of understanding what it took for me to be successful. And now I'm at a place where it's like, okay, this is what I learned. This is what I experienced over all of these years of still studying television production in multiple facets of the industry at the same time, you know, I did a lot in a shorter period of time. And now it's like, okay, this is the information that I've learned as an independent contractor. Now I am giving this to you will be successful. And I'm just going to, I'm going to go and spend time with my family because I didn't for so long, you know?
Speaker 0 00:45:57 Yeah, no, I get it. Well, I know we're, we're working to get wrapped up here. Two last things. Um, number one, if somebody wants to become a projectionist, they want that to become their career. They're saying, man, that looks awesome. Um, I have to say it's one of my first loves as being a technician, being a projectionist, creating the environment, whether it's mapping or screens or blends, um, if they want to work their way into that, what can they do? And I'm sure you talk about this in your book. Um, but what can they do to become a, uh, to become a projectionist? Yeah. W what can they do to work their way into that
Speaker 2 00:46:35 Study? If you're already on sites, study, what other people are doing with me, build relationships with other projectionists and just study their methods, observe, ask questions gently, you know, don't be too aggressive when someone's in the middle of trying to work. Right. But I mean, that's how I did it. There were no schools, there were no classes. There were nurse, no certifications, not saying that there's anything wrong with that, right? Because it is helping you to move up, but there's something to be said for experience. And yes, you're learning from the experience from other people in these controlled environments, but what happens when you're not in the controlled environment? So I'd say the first step is to get to know a video projectionist, build a relationship with them. If you're already on sites, study from them. If you aren't doing shows the group walking into this and shoot for the first time, start from the ground up as a stage, work your way up, take some classes.
Speaker 2 00:47:31 Yes. Education is key, right? Take some classes so you can learn, um, the aspects of the projector, techniques, things like that. But from those classes, don't walk on a show site and say, I'm a projectionist. There's no, you're not a projectionist, a video projectionists use someone who's taken video projection, video projection classes. There's a difference. And I'm not knocking anyone for their process or anyone for the steps that they're taking their career. Just understand that there is a way to do it. And there's a way to also build respect and rapport in the industry, by going through some of the things and getting some events under your belt before just walking into a large scale of it. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:48:13 And they should buy the book career projection, because that is the number one ticket to becoming a projectionist, uh, as your career. So the, uh, aside from buying the book, which I need to get a copy of it, honestly, um, I think it's, uh,
Speaker 2 00:48:29 You will, you can go to, you can go to Clem co ab.com/career one Oh one,
Speaker 0 00:48:37 What I'm going to do. Uh, I'll actually put everything in the notes within there. So, you know, we'll put a bit in the book, we'll put a, we'll put everything else in there so that everybody knows how they can get their hands on it. Um, you know, we've been on a long break, uh, you know, nobody's been gigging, um, but it's going to come back. We're going to have more opportunity. What are two things that every individual, whether they are video, audio lighting, special effects, scenic doesn't matter that they can do to be more gig ready. The next time we're doing gigs, what are two things that you can think of that could be the smallest, the biggest, um, how can we be more ready to, how can we be more gig ready? The next time we come back and start doing shows again?
Speaker 2 00:49:24 I think one of the most important things that someone can do during this time is to understand their budget, understand their, their, their, their, their, um, their cashflow and understand what's going on with their finances. Right. We've gone through a time where we haven't had any work come in. So you've had to go through the process of stripping down to the bare essentials, right? So when money starts blowing back in, don't just jump right back to where you were. Don't do that. It's not the most responsible thing, operate at a place at a sustainable place in life and in your business, and just continue to grow that way. Right? A budget is one of the, is the most important thing as an independent contractor, as any company, any business, to understand your finances, um, on top of that, continue to build your relationships. Don't just stand. Don't just, you know, sit in your corner during this time, when, when people are having zoom meetings, people are having still trying to have networking events. Um, people are doing things to build their business and build their brand, uh, continue to stay connected to people in the industry. So mind your money, mind your finances, and continue to be connected to people in the industry, top two things to do
Speaker 0 00:50:35 Outstanding. Um, great, great, uh, wisdom there in terms of, uh, understanding that you're the first person to talk anything about finances, um, in, in all of everything that we've been, you know, the past 10 episodes and everything else, it's so important and critical to understand that. So thank you for bringing that up. I love that. Um, thanks again for coming out today. I know, uh, you know, that that finding time can be challenging family and everything else going on. So thanks so much for taking the time. Um, career projection, uh, is the book that Clem Harrod has written. It is a book focused on helping you be better at, uh, not just projection, but audio visual and learning how
Speaker 2 00:51:24 Any independent contractor, any independent contractor, any small business owner, like I have a personal trainer that I work with, who also uses this book. So please don't let the title confuse you. This is not about video projection. This is about career projection, and we're using the word projection as forecasting. Both. We're thinking how to achieve something in your latter years, as you start to day.
Speaker 0 00:51:50 I love man. I hadn't even thought about that. Um, but projection, totally, dude. That's fantastic. Well done.
Speaker 2 00:51:57 That's why I'm a projection is not video projection. I'm a projectionist I'm talking about today, where you're tomorrow. Come on, man.
Speaker 0 00:52:04 That's awesome. I love it. Great, dude. It's such a great, it's such a great inference. That's fantastic. Um, so give us real quick. How can people get ahold of you if they want to talk? If they want to talk to Clem co, they want to talk to Clem Harrod. What's the best way to reach out and chat?
Speaker 2 00:52:21 Well, I'm available on all platforms, right? All social media platforms, LinkedIn, not so much. If you really want to get in contact with me or find me message me through Instagram, like I'm a visual person I'm on Instagram, I'm on Facebook. You can find me on LinkedIn. My website is Glencoe aav.com, C L E M C O period, a B as the brand, right. Clinical AB, but the website is Clem co a b.com. Um, awesome. Yeah, just hit me up. Perfect.
Speaker 0 00:52:51 We'll link it. Uh, we'll link it in the show notes. We'll also link to the book. Uh, you should get your copy, uh, see if you can beat me to get in mine. And, uh, I hope you guys have an outstanding day, Clem, thanks for joining us today. And, uh, couldn't have been happier with, uh, with the outcome, great conversation, and really had a great time.
Speaker 2 00:53:11 Awesome. Thanks for having me. You're welcome.
Speaker 0 00:53:13 Thanks. Have a great day. Thanks for listening today. It's been a great episode and I hope you learned something. If you did go out and tell somebody, let them know that they can be a better professional to the best
Speaker 3 00:53:26 Thing that you can do for those around you is help them become better at what we do and how we do it. As professionals. There is nothing more that we want to see than an amazing event and events don't happen without you. Thanks for listening. Thanks for being a part. Let us know how we can do better and we'll see you next time.
Speaker 1 00:53:46 <inaudible>.
